fpc & Lazarus with 64-bit

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fpc & Lazarus with 64-bit

Joep L. Blom
Hi,
I recently retrieved fpc-pascal 2.0.2a from the Lazarus download site
together with Lazarus 0.9.16.
System: AMD64 1 Gb mem. sufficient disk space, Linux 2.6.17-1.2139_FC5.
My problems:
1.
Starting "fp" freezes the terminal window. When I do "fp &", the window
is accessible but the first keystroke stops fp.
"fpc hello" (as said in the manual) doesn't work (neither from root nor
from a user-terminal).
"fpc helloworld" when in the helloworld directory works.
2. (I don't know if this is the right place)
Installing Lazarus gives:
"error: Failed dependencies:libgdk_pixbuf.so.2 is needed by
lazarus-0.9.16-0.i386"
However "locate libgdk_pixbuf.so.2" gives:
"/usr/lib64/libgdk_pixbuf.so.2
/usr/lib64/libgdk_pixbuf.so.2.0.0"
I did this with the fpc retrieved from the lazarus site.
TAfter removing fpc completely I installed fpc 2.0.2-4.fc5 (Fedora site)
which of course caused lazarus to refuse to install.
My conclusions:
1. fpc will compile programs on a 64-bit system.
2. The IDE is not tuned to a 64-bit system (strange however for a fedora
64-bit system)
3. The Lazarus rpm is not rigged for the 64-bit fpc.
My questions:
1. Can programs compiled on a 64-bit system run on a 32-bit system (or
is there a setting for it).
2. Does anybody have a solution as I'm a Pascal programmer from way back
(started in 1985 with Borland Pascal for the Amstrad (does anybody
remember this machine??)) and it is my opinion that Pascal is one of the
best designed programming languages and fpc (I have tested it last year
on a 32-bit system) a very good superset of the good old BPC 7.0.
Therefore I would like to use it with Lazarus as a (sub?)set of Delphi.
Thanks in advance
Joep




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Re: fpc & Lazarus with 64-bit

Alain Michaud
Hi,

  I wanted to install fpc/laz on a friend's AMD64 myself a fey days ago
in order to show the "power of FPC" but I realized quickly that AMD64 is
a different "animal".

I can not answer any of your questions as I am not a developer.

However I can say that there are as many platform to support as there
are developers! It seems that their big effort right now is towards
GTK-2 as the older (GTK-1) will soon not be supplied on some
distributions. I understand this is a big priority for them!

Now for AMD 64: I think that there are some developers working on this.
The progress may not be as fast as one would like it to be, but we have
to understand that it is a lot of work for the very small group of
developers. If AMD64 becomes more popular, then the developers will
quickly want to use it too and quickly we will have something that
works.

Now for pascal: there are endless discussions on this list about that.
The conclusions are always the same:

Pascal will not die because we do not want that to die...

Cheers

Alain
 

p.s. If you find out what to do install lazarus on AMD 64, please let us
know.

Question - 1:

Once I have installed the module: fpc-2.0.2.x86_64-linux.tar then does
that means that I use the "regular" source code: fpc-2.0.2.source.tar.gz
in order to recompile FPC or to compile lazarus?

Question - 2 :

Is there a special Lazarus version for AMD64 ? Does it work on AMD64 ?



On Sun, 2006-07-02 at 15:42 +0200, J.L. Blom wrote:

> Hi,
> I recently retrieved fpc-pascal 2.0.2a from the Lazarus download site
> together with Lazarus 0.9.16.
> System: AMD64 1 Gb mem. sufficient disk space, Linux 2.6.17-1.2139_FC5.
> My problems:
> 1.
> Starting "fp" freezes the terminal window. When I do "fp &", the window
> is accessible but the first keystroke stops fp.
> "fpc hello" (as said in the manual) doesn't work (neither from root nor
> from a user-terminal).
> "fpc helloworld" when in the helloworld directory works.
> 2. (I don't know if this is the right place)
> Installing Lazarus gives:
> "error: Failed dependencies:libgdk_pixbuf.so.2 is needed by
> lazarus-0.9.16-0.i386"
> However "locate libgdk_pixbuf.so.2" gives:
> "/usr/lib64/libgdk_pixbuf.so.2
> /usr/lib64/libgdk_pixbuf.so.2.0.0"
> I did this with the fpc retrieved from the lazarus site.
> TAfter removing fpc completely I installed fpc 2.0.2-4.fc5 (Fedora site)
> which of course caused lazarus to refuse to install.
> My conclusions:
> 1. fpc will compile programs on a 64-bit system.
> 2. The IDE is not tuned to a 64-bit system (strange however for a fedora
> 64-bit system)
> 3. The Lazarus rpm is not rigged for the 64-bit fpc.
> My questions:
> 1. Can programs compiled on a 64-bit system run on a 32-bit system (or
> is there a setting for it).
> 2. Does anybody have a solution as I'm a Pascal programmer from way back
> (started in 1985 with Borland Pascal for the Amstrad (does anybody
> remember this machine??)) and it is my opinion that Pascal is one of the
> best designed programming languages and fpc (I have tested it last year
> on a 32-bit system) a very good superset of the good old BPC 7.0.
> Therefore I would like to use it with Lazarus as a (sub?)set of Delphi.
> Thanks in advance
> Joep
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
> http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal

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Re: fpc & Lazarus with 64-bit

Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho
On 7/2/06, Alain Michaud <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Question - 1:
>
> Once I have installed the module: fpc-2.0.2.x86_64-linux.tar then does
> that means that I use the "regular" source code: fpc-2.0.2.source.tar.gz
> in order to recompile FPC or to compile lazarus?

I think that you need to install fpc-2.0.2.x86_64-linux.tar and then
use that to compile lazarus source code. Just download a package with
Lazarus source code and do a:

make clean all

If this doesn´t work, then report what problems you had.

> Question - 2 :
>
> Is there a special Lazarus version for AMD64 ? Does it work on AMD64 ?

Please test! =) There is no pre-compiled binary for download, that´s
for sure, but this may be because there is no mainteiner. I think it
works. Well, it even works on win64!

If this does work, you could consider taking the Lazarus source RPM,
compile it and produce a amd64 rpm package, and send it back to be
included as a Lazarus download.

--
Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho
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Re: fpc & Lazarus with 64-bit

Vincent Snijders
Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho wrote:

> On 7/2/06, Alain Michaud <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Question - 2 :
>>
>> Is there a special Lazarus version for AMD64 ? Does it work on AMD64 ?
>
>
> Please test! =) There is no pre-compiled binary for download, that´s
> for sure, but this may be because there is no mainteiner. I think it
> works. Well, it even works on win64!
>
> If this does work, you could consider taking the Lazarus source RPM,
> compile it and produce a amd64 rpm package, and send it back to be
> included as a Lazarus download.
>

There are no x86_64 rpms, because at first we didn't have access to a
x86_64 to build it. When I got (ssh-)access to one I started building
snapshots using fpc 2.1.1, see
http://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/Lazarus_Snapshots_Downloads 
for downloads. (Don't forget to read the disclaimer.)

IMHO fpc 2.0.2 is not stable enough for lazarus on x86_64, so no
releases are made yet. I hope the upcoming fpc 2.0.4 will be good enough.

Vincent.
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Re: fpc & Lazarus with 64-bit

Joep L. Blom
On Mon, 2006-07-03 at 07:11 +0200, Vincent Snijders wrote:

> Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho wrote:
> > On 7/2/06, Alain Michaud <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> >> Question - 2 :
> >>
> >> Is there a special Lazarus version for AMD64 ? Does it work on AMD64 ?
> >
> >
> > Please test! =) There is no pre-compiled binary for download, that´s
> > for sure, but this may be because there is no mainteiner. I think it
> > works. Well, it even works on win64!
> >
> > If this does work, you could consider taking the Lazarus source RPM,
> > compile it and produce a amd64 rpm package, and send it back to be
> > included as a Lazarus download.
> >
>
> There are no x86_64 rpms, because at first we didn't have access to a
> x86_64 to build it. When I got (ssh-)access to one I started building
> snapshots using fpc 2.1.1, see
> http://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/Lazarus_Snapshots_Downloads 
> for downloads. (Don't forget to read the disclaimer.)
>
> IMHO fpc 2.0.2 is not stable enough for lazarus on x86_64, so no
> releases are made yet. I hope the upcoming fpc 2.0.4 will be good enough.
>
> Vincent.
> _______________________________________________
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Akain, Filipe, Vincent,
Thanks for your answers and advice.
At least it's reassuring that's not ignorance on my side that causes the
problems. With the limited use of the examples ( I only tested a few) it
seems that fpc 2.0.2-4.fc5 (is that a snapshot version? I can't find it
on the site) is working "out-of-the-(rpm)box" but that the IDE fails. Of
course you can write programs using some editor but from the earliest
(Borland) pascal on, the IDE was an invaluable tool. I would like to
know why it won't start in a 64-bit environment and if there is a source
that can be compiled separately and is compatible with fpc 2.0.2-4.fc5.
Filipe, I will try to compile a source but I assume I have to change the
makefile rather heavily to account for the different environment and the
different fpc version. Although being retired my time is limited (for
various reasons) so it may take a while.
You'll here from me.
Joep


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Re: fpc & Lazarus with 64-bit

Vincent Snijders
J.L. Blom schreef:

> On Mon, 2006-07-03 at 07:11 +0200, Vincent Snijders wrote:
>> Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho wrote:
>>> On 7/2/06, Alain Michaud <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Question - 2 :
>>>>
>>>> Is there a special Lazarus version for AMD64 ? Does it work on AMD64 ?
>>>
>>> Please test! =) There is no pre-compiled binary for download, that´s
>>> for sure, but this may be because there is no mainteiner. I think it
>>> works. Well, it even works on win64!
>>>
>>> If this does work, you could consider taking the Lazarus source RPM,
>>> compile it and produce a amd64 rpm package, and send it back to be
>>> included as a Lazarus download.
>>>
>> There are no x86_64 rpms, because at first we didn't have access to a
>> x86_64 to build it. When I got (ssh-)access to one I started building
>> snapshots using fpc 2.1.1, see
>> http://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/Lazarus_Snapshots_Downloads 
>> for downloads. (Don't forget to read the disclaimer.)
>>
>> IMHO fpc 2.0.2 is not stable enough for lazarus on x86_64, so no
>> releases are made yet. I hope the upcoming fpc 2.0.4 will be good enough.
>>
>> Vincent.
>> _______________________________________________
>> fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
>> http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
> Akain, Filipe, Vincent,
> Thanks for your answers and advice.
> At least it's reassuring that's not ignorance on my side that causes the
> problems. With the limited use of the examples ( I only tested a few) it
> seems that fpc 2.0.2-4.fc5 (is that a snapshot version? I can't find it
> on the site) is working "out-of-the-(rpm)box" but that the IDE fails. Of
> course you can write programs using some editor but from the earliest
> (Borland) pascal on, the IDE was an invaluable tool. I would like to
> know why it won't start in a 64-bit environment and if there is a source
> that can be compiled separately and is compatible with fpc 2.0.2-4.fc5.
> Filipe, I will try to compile a source but I assume I have to change the
> makefile rather heavily to account for the different environment and the
> different fpc version. Although being retired my time is limited (for
> various reasons) so it may take a while.

There are no 64 bits rpms for lazarus, except for snapshots.

So either use the snapshot rpms (http://www.hu.freepascal.org/lazarus/), release
source rpms
(http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=89339&package_id=192183&release_id=420760)
or follow the steps to compile from source:
http://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/Installing_Lazarus#Installing_from_source

Note, that you need three things: fpc, source code of fpc units (for code
completion, e.g. fpc-src-2.0.2.xxx.rpm) and lazarus

Vincent
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Re: fpc & Lazarus with 64-bit

Joep L. Blom
On Mon, 2006-07-03 at 10:39 +0200, Vincent Snijders wrote:
> J.L. Blom schreef:

> There are no 64 bits rpms for lazarus, except for snapshots.
>
> So either use the snapshot rpms (http://www.hu.freepascal.org/lazarus/), release
> source rpms
> (http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=89339&package_id=192183&release_id=420760)
> or follow the steps to compile from source:
> http://wiki.lazarus.freepascal.org/index.php/Installing_Lazarus#Installing_from_source
>
> Note, that you need three things: fpc, source code of fpc units (for code
> completion, e.g. fpc-src-2.0.2.xxx.rpm) and lazarus
>
> Vincent
Thanks, Vincent,
Yes I had figured it out but fpc-2.0.20-4fc5 and fpc-src_.. (and
fpc-doc...) are all in the FC5 package list.
Well, your mail gave me the link (http://www.hu.freepascal.org/lazarus/)
that shows an fpc,  fpc-src and lazarus rpm's for 64 bit!
I hope later this day to give it a try (they are timestamped today) your
working??)
If it functions as expected I'll report back and will inform the Fedora
maintainers (probably via the forum).
Joep


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Re: fpc & Lazarus with 64-bit

Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho
In reply to this post by Joep L. Blom
On 7/3/06, J.L. Blom <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Filipe, I will try to compile a source but I assume I have to change the
> makefile rather heavily to account for the different environment and the
> different fpc version.

No, you won´t. If you look into the Makefile you will notice it is
already prepared for a huge number of architectures-operating system
combinations. Also, the compiler version doesn´t change it´s
executable name, so it has no effect on the Makefile. Only be careful
to have the correct version on the compiler on the Path in case you
have 2 different compilers installed.

Really, it´s just: make clean all =)

If it fails and the path is correct, then the compiler version is the problem.

thanks,
--
Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho
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Re: fpc & Lazarus with 64-bit

Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho
In reply to this post by Joep L. Blom
On 7/3/06, J.L. Blom <[hidden email]> wrote:
> course you can write programs using some editor but from the earliest
> (Borland) pascal on, the IDE was an invaluable tool.

Isn´t is possible to run 32-bit software on your machine? I heard that
some amd 64-bits machines can acctually run 32-bit software some how
(has 2 processors, one 64 and one 32 or something like that). This way
you could install the compiler and the IDE for 32-bits! It would also
solve your question.

> My questions:
> 1. Can programs compiled on a 64-bit system run on a 32-bit system (or
> is there a setting for it).

This will require a cross-built. The first thing to do is find
cross-binutils suitable. I mean, as (the assembler), ld (the linker),
strip and other binutils that run on a 64-bits environment but
generate binaries for 32 bits.

Then you have to generate a cross-compiler (recompile the compiler to
do that), and integrate everything.

Instead, this would be instantaneously solved if your machine can run
32-bit software.

--
Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho
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Re: fpc & Lazarus with 64-bit

Michael Van Canneyt


On Mon, 3 Jul 2006, Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho wrote:

> On 7/3/06, J.L. Blom <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> course you can write programs using some editor but from the earliest
>> (Borland) pascal on, the IDE was an invaluable tool.
>
> Isn´t is possible to run 32-bit software on your machine? I heard that
> some amd 64-bits machines can acctually run 32-bit software some how
> (has 2 processors, one 64 and one 32 or something like that). This way
> you could install the compiler and the IDE for 32-bits! It would also
> solve your question.

Linux distributions support running 32-bit apps on an AMD64. This has
little to do with the AMD64 processor itself.

I can perfectly run the 32-bit ppc386 on a 64-bit SuSE Linux.

Michael.
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Re: fpc & Lazarus with 64-bit

Joep L. Blom
In reply to this post by Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho
On Mon, 2006-07-03 at 10:45 -0300, Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho wrote:

> On 7/3/06, J.L. Blom <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > Filipe, I will try to compile a source but I assume I have to change the
> > makefile rather heavily to account for the different environment and the
> > different fpc version.
>
> No, you won´t. If you look into the Makefile you will notice it is
> already prepared for a huge number of architectures-operating system
> combinations. Also, the compiler version doesn´t change it´s
> executable name, so it has no effect on the Makefile. Only be careful
> to have the correct version on the compiler on the Path in case you
> have 2 different compilers installed.
>
> Really, it´s just: make clean all =)
>
> If it fails and the path is correct, then the compiler version is the problem.
>
> thanks,
Felipe,
Thanks. I will first try the current .rpm snapshot which is especially
for 64-bit as well of fpc as for Lazarus.
I'll report back
Joep


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Re: fpc & Lazarus with 64-bit

Joep L. Blom
In reply to this post by Michael Van Canneyt
On Mon, 2006-07-03 at 15:55 +0200, Michael Van Canneyt wrote:
>
> On Mon, 3 Jul 2006, Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho wrote:

> Linux distributions support running 32-bit apps on an AMD64. This has
> little to do with the AMD64 processor itself.
>
> I can perfectly run the 32-bit ppc386 on a 64-bit SuSE Linux.
>
> Michael.
> _
YEs, Michael, but my 64-bit FC5 can't run a 32-bit firefox, so I must
use the 64-bit version.
Joep


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Re: fpc & Lazarus with 64-bit

Jonas Maebe-2

On 3 jul 2006, at 17:51, J.L. Blom wrote:

> YEs, Michael, but my 64-bit FC5 can't run a 32-bit firefox, so I must
> use the 64-bit version.

That's probably because you don't have 32 bit versions installed of  
all the libraries it requires.


Jonas
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Re: fpc & Lazarus with 64-bit

Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho
There is a post here about fpc with athlon 64:

http://community.freepascal.org:10000/bboards/message?message_id=155270&forum_id=24083#231973

It could be of use.

--
Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho
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Re: fpc & Lazarus with 64-bit

Joep L. Blom
On Mon, 2006-07-03 at 18:35 -0300, Felipe Monteiro de Carvalho wrote:
> There is a post here about fpc with athlon 64:
>
> http://community.freepascal.org:10000/bboards/message?message_id=155270&forum_id=24083#231973
>
> It could be of use.
>
Felipe thanks, but that is not much relevant as it has to do with fpc
running in 32-bit Linux on a AMD64 and that works( at least it did last
year) but I want to run it in 64-bit Linux.
I have installed the overnight snapshot fpc-2.1.1-20060702.x86_64.rpm
and it src companion without problems. However, fp is missing so I
cannot start the ide (is it not in this package?).
Then I installed lazarus-0.9.17-20060702.x86_64.rpm Also without a
problem. when I started it the lazarus environment appeared. It gave a
lot of warnings apparently due to the fact that the config-file was not
quite correct but at least it started. However, I cannot do anything at
all. When I try to drag e.g. a button to the form the buttonname is
crossed and no button appears on the form. In the console it is
complaining with all kind of messages (part is following):
[root@laguna tmp]# lazarus &
[3] 22538
[root@laguna tmp]# TApplication.IconChanged - TODO: convert this
message...no implementation in gtk or win32
NOTE: miscellaneous options file not found - using defaults
NOTE: codetools config file not found - using defaults
NOTE: help options config file not found - using defaults
TMainIDE.DoNewProject A
TMainIDE.DoNewEditorFile A NewFilename=
[TCustomFormEditor.CreateComponent] Class='TForm'
TMainIDE.DoNewEditorFile end unit1.pas
TApplication.HandleException Access violation
  Stack trace:
  $0000003A16C3D242
and then a lot of lines like this, but it doesn't crash.
I have not much experience with Lazarus so I have to dig into the
manual(s) but at least it's a start. The same happens when I start as a
normal user and not as "god".
Well a start is made. I first am going to find out where I can find the
IDE, the lazarus problem will follow.
If somebody has suggestions pleas let me know.
Joep


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