New Get Lazarus Initiative

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New Get Lazarus Initiative

Anthony Walter-3
I am please to announce the launch of a new initiative to promote Free Pascal and Lazarus. The hub of this initiative is http://www.getlazarus.org

The get Lazarus initiative aims to an reintroduce Lazarus to the software development world. To aide in this endeavor we've created our own special Lazarus bundles for Windows, Mac, and Linux with test versions of Free Pascal 3.0 Lazarus 1.4. We believe these bundles are the easiest Lazarus environments to install ever, and they won't interfere with your existing Free Pascal and Lazarus environments. We've also built-in support for full cross compile between platforms by default.

Our initiative hub http://www.getlazarus.org is built on a new custom wiki engine which allows for creation of some highly interactive wiki pages. The showcase page http://www.getlazarus.org/community/showcase is a good example of this. 

We also have a new Lazarus forum http://www.getlazarus.org/forums themed to match the initiative. We're going to be looking for forum moderators and official wiki administrators soon. See this forum topic for consideration http://www.getlazarus.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=3

And finally we are forming a professional Free Pascal and Lazarus consultant network for select few community members. Members will be invited to participate in commercial software projects as requests are filtered through our site.

Thank you to everyone for your attention and thank you for helping to promote Free Pascal and Lazarus! It's a great time to be a Lazarus fan!

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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

Jonas Maebe-2
On 04/02/15 06:00, Anthony Walter wrote:
> The get Lazarus initiative aims to an reintroduce Lazarus to the
> software development world. To aide in this endeavor we've created our
> own special Lazarus bundles for Windows, Mac, and Linux with test
> versions of Free Pascal 3.0 Lazarus 1.4.

Thank you for this initiative, but please do not say on your website
that you are providing FPC 3.0, as it does not yet exist. In one place
it does say "test version", but not everywhere, and all test versions
have (or definitely should have) different version numbers than 3.0:
either 2.7.1 or 3.0.1 (and possibly a 3.0rc1, 3.0rc2, ...).

There will only be one actual version 3.0, and that will be the final,
official release. Doing so helps in particular with bug reports, as we
will never have to ask "are you using the official release or a snapshot
from before or after". Also, if people report bugs for your version, it
would be useful if you could mention from which revision their sources
are built so they can say so on the bug tracker.


Jonas
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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

Anthony Walter-3
Jonas, I hope this helps.

I try to say Test versions of Free Pascal 3.0 all over the place on the website. The installers all say test version of Free Pascal 3.0. The Windows Installer says this in really big bold words up top when you launch the setup.exe. All the icons on the end users systems say Free Pascal 3.0 Test or Lazarus 1.4 Test.

From my What's New page:

Free Pascal is rapidly approaching 3.0 status and this website bundles the most current fixes 3.0 branch in all of our Lazarus downloads. This major new version of Free Pascal includes new some fantastic new languages features, greater stability, better support for ARM processors, and many other small improvements. Thanks go out to the Free Pascal development team for all your hard work.

The first sentence of the http://www.getlazarus.org/setup page:

This page will assist users in obtaining test versions of Free Pascal 3.0 and Lazarus 1.4.

If you have ideas on how to be more clear, please let me know.



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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

Anthony Walter-3
Jonas, I'll re-add the svn revision number in my next round of builds wich will follow shortly. I was rebuilding all OS bundles from the same revision and copied them to my test systems. Unfortunately I deleted all the svn tracking files before I did my first copy, which removes maybe 100s of megabytes. anyhow, next build 'll leave in the svn revision file for Lazarus to read and present in the about page.

Oh an regarding Test in my prior message. If anyone wants to clarify that I am bundling FPC 3.0 in a testing stage on any page on the initiative, just click "edit page", make your addition, and I'll merge it in using my moderator utilities. If anyone wants the responsibility to handle some of the edit moderation with me, go to our announcement in the forums and send me a PM (I'm admin). The main website moderator tools carry over from the forums section of the site.

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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

Jonas Maebe-2

On 04 Feb 2015, at 11:37, Anthony Walter wrote:

> Jonas, I'll re-add the svn revision number in my next round of  
> builds wich
> will follow shortly. I was rebuilding all OS bundles from the same  
> revision
> and copied them to my test systems. Unfortunately I deleted all the  
> svn
> tracking files before I did my first copy, which removes maybe 100s of
> megabytes. anyhow, next build 'll leave in the svn revision file for
> Lazarus to read and present in the about page.

We have 2.7.1, 3.0.1, and in the future we'll also have 3.0 and  
(probably) 3.0rc1, but a generic test version of 3.0 does not exist. I  
understand you don't want to overload people with details, especially  
with the confusing situation where there is already a 3.0.1, but no  
3.0 yet (it probably would have been better to make the version number  
in the fixes branch 2.9.9 instead of immediately 3.0.1, but that's a  
bit too late now).

Nevertheless, I'm afraid this will become a maintenance and support  
nightmare due to confusion. E.g., since there is no way to select "3.0  
testing" on the bug tracker, people will probably just select "3.0" as  
version (once it becomes a selectable option). Similarly, 3.0rc1 will  
be the first "official" test version of 3.0, and if people then start  
report 3.0rc1 as version while they used one of your test versions...

I think the easiest option is to simply call it 3.0.1 (test version or  
not). Once 3.0 is released, you can then either change it to 3.0  
(there will undoubtedly be a few questions regarding why it went from  
3.0.1 to 3.0, but that can then be explained) or keep updating to  
newer and newer 3.0.1 versions (since I guess the main point is to  
provide people with easy advance testing of newer FPC versions than  
the latest release).

You can also get the FPC revision number in the compiler by creating  
an empty revision.inc file in the fpc/compiler directory and running  
make (if "svnversion" is in the path and the svn metadata is available).

> Oh an regarding Test in my prior message. If anyone wants to clarify  
> that I
> am bundling FPC 3.0 in a testing stage on any page on the  
> initiative, just
> click "edit page", make your addition, and I'll merge it in using my
> moderator utilities.

At least the first sentence under "Installation" and under "Windows"  
at http://www.getlazarus.org/setup/ only mention 3.0 and don't say  
anything about testing. Unless you repeat that word everywhere, you  
can be certain that most people will only see "3.0" (well, even if you  
do repeat it they will probably still only see "3.0").


Jonas
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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

Anthony Walter-3
Okay, I'll work on new builds ASAP which include the revision numbers from inside Lazarus as well as clearly labeled revision text files placed in the FPC and Lazarus folders. These files will contain the branch name and SVN revision number.

I've modified the line you mentioned to read "To get the testing versions of Free Pascal 3.0 and Lazarus 1.4 download the setup program".

To everyone else, anyone can edit the pages, so if anyone cares to clarify anything on any page, just click edit this page and I'll review an apply the changes.

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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

Marcos Douglas B. Santos
In reply to this post by Anthony Walter-3
On Wed, Feb 4, 2015 at 2:00 AM, Anthony Walter <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I am please to announce the launch of a new initiative to promote Free
> Pascal and Lazarus. The hub of this initiative is http://www.getlazarus.org
>
> The get Lazarus initiative aims to an reintroduce Lazarus to the software
> development world. To aide in this endeavor we've created our own special
> Lazarus bundles for Windows, Mac, and Linux with test versions of Free
> Pascal 3.0 Lazarus 1.4. We believe these bundles are the easiest Lazarus
> environments to install ever, and they won't interfere with your existing
> Free Pascal and Lazarus environments. We've also built-in support for full
> cross compile between platforms by default.
>
> Our initiative hub http://www.getlazarus.org is built on a new custom wiki
> engine which allows for creation of some highly interactive wiki pages. The
> showcase page http://www.getlazarus.org/community/showcase is a good example
> of this.
>
> We also have a new Lazarus forum http://www.getlazarus.org/forums themed to
> match the initiative. We're going to be looking for forum moderators and
> official wiki administrators soon. See this forum topic for consideration
> http://www.getlazarus.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=3
>
> And finally we are forming a professional Free Pascal and Lazarus consultant
> network for select few community members. Members will be invited to
> participate in commercial software projects as requests are filtered through
> our site.
>
> Thank you to everyone for your attention and thank you for helping to
> promote Free Pascal and Lazarus! It's a great time to be a Lazarus fan!

Very nice. Good for community.
The wiki engine and site was build using the same engine (improved)
that you use in Bare.Game project? Is this opensource too?

Best regards,
Marcos Douglas
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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

Daniel Franzini
In reply to this post by Anthony Walter-3
Congratulations for such initiative. Very nice. I hope this helps Lazarus/FPC to get more visibility.

Just one point: I'd strongly recommend you provide a build with stable/production versions of Lazarus and FreePascal. They are the best the Lazarus/FPC team can offer and they have production quality. This will indeed help people giving it a try to get more confident with Lazarus/FPC.

On Wed, Feb 4, 2015 at 3:00 AM, Anthony Walter <[hidden email]> wrote:
I am please to announce the launch of a new initiative to promote Free Pascal and Lazarus. The hub of this initiative is http://www.getlazarus.org

The get Lazarus initiative aims to an reintroduce Lazarus to the software development world. To aide in this endeavor we've created our own special Lazarus bundles for Windows, Mac, and Linux with test versions of Free Pascal 3.0 Lazarus 1.4. We believe these bundles are the easiest Lazarus environments to install ever, and they won't interfere with your existing Free Pascal and Lazarus environments. We've also built-in support for full cross compile between platforms by default.

Our initiative hub http://www.getlazarus.org is built on a new custom wiki engine which allows for creation of some highly interactive wiki pages. The showcase page http://www.getlazarus.org/community/showcase is a good example of this. 

We also have a new Lazarus forum http://www.getlazarus.org/forums themed to match the initiative. We're going to be looking for forum moderators and official wiki administrators soon. See this forum topic for consideration http://www.getlazarus.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=3

And finally we are forming a professional Free Pascal and Lazarus consultant network for select few community members. Members will be invited to participate in commercial software projects as requests are filtered through our site.

Thank you to everyone for your attention and thank you for helping to promote Free Pascal and Lazarus! It's a great time to be a Lazarus fan!

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--
Daniel

"Let us change our traditional attitude to the construction of programs. Instead of imagining that our main task is to instruct a computer what to do, let us concentrate rather on explaining to human beings what we want a computer to do." (Donald Knuth)

"Yes, technogeeks can be funny, even if only to each other." (http://www.boogieonline.com/revolution/science/humor/)"

"Man is driven to create; I know I really love to create things. And while I'm not good at painting, drawing, or music, I can write software." (Yukihiro Matsumoto, a.k.a. ``Matz'')

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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

Daniel Franzini
Quick fix: in the download page, the link to the InnoSetup website is wrong. Should be: http://www.getlazarus.org/setup/www.jrsoftware.org/isinfo.php

On Wed, Feb 4, 2015 at 10:15 AM, Daniel Franzini <[hidden email]> wrote:
Congratulations for such initiative. Very nice. I hope this helps Lazarus/FPC to get more visibility.

Just one point: I'd strongly recommend you provide a build with stable/production versions of Lazarus and FreePascal. They are the best the Lazarus/FPC team can offer and they have production quality. This will indeed help people giving it a try to get more confident with Lazarus/FPC.

On Wed, Feb 4, 2015 at 3:00 AM, Anthony Walter <[hidden email]> wrote:
I am please to announce the launch of a new initiative to promote Free Pascal and Lazarus. The hub of this initiative is http://www.getlazarus.org

The get Lazarus initiative aims to an reintroduce Lazarus to the software development world. To aide in this endeavor we've created our own special Lazarus bundles for Windows, Mac, and Linux with test versions of Free Pascal 3.0 Lazarus 1.4. We believe these bundles are the easiest Lazarus environments to install ever, and they won't interfere with your existing Free Pascal and Lazarus environments. We've also built-in support for full cross compile between platforms by default.

Our initiative hub http://www.getlazarus.org is built on a new custom wiki engine which allows for creation of some highly interactive wiki pages. The showcase page http://www.getlazarus.org/community/showcase is a good example of this. 

We also have a new Lazarus forum http://www.getlazarus.org/forums themed to match the initiative. We're going to be looking for forum moderators and official wiki administrators soon. See this forum topic for consideration http://www.getlazarus.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=3

And finally we are forming a professional Free Pascal and Lazarus consultant network for select few community members. Members will be invited to participate in commercial software projects as requests are filtered through our site.

Thank you to everyone for your attention and thank you for helping to promote Free Pascal and Lazarus! It's a great time to be a Lazarus fan!

_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal



--
Daniel

"Let us change our traditional attitude to the construction of programs. Instead of imagining that our main task is to instruct a computer what to do, let us concentrate rather on explaining to human beings what we want a computer to do." (Donald Knuth)

"Yes, technogeeks can be funny, even if only to each other." (http://www.boogieonline.com/revolution/science/humor/)"

"Man is driven to create; I know I really love to create things. And while I'm not good at painting, drawing, or music, I can write software." (Yukihiro Matsumoto, a.k.a. ``Matz'')



--
Daniel

"Let us change our traditional attitude to the construction of programs. Instead of imagining that our main task is to instruct a computer what to do, let us concentrate rather on explaining to human beings what we want a computer to do." (Donald Knuth)

"Yes, technogeeks can be funny, even if only to each other." (http://www.boogieonline.com/revolution/science/humor/)"

"Man is driven to create; I know I really love to create things. And while I'm not good at painting, drawing, or music, I can write software." (Yukihiro Matsumoto, a.k.a. ``Matz'')

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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

Anthony Walter-3
In reply to this post by Marcos Douglas B. Santos
Marcos, I build the Bare Game website engine using asp classic with javascript on the server. I am a huge javascript fan, and I've used asp classic since 1998.

But this new site is built on a dead simple C# engine basic on a POCO library which implements the bare minimum IHttpHandler interface. Using the bare minimum (Bare Game) and writing things myself seem to work well for me.

Anyhow the interesting thing about the C# library is how I designed it to reads template files which can be nested. The templated values try to format themselves from properties on the page you define, and you can use all C# formatting options in the template. The basics minus my wiki page class (200 lines of code derived from PageHandler) are hosted here if you want to take a look: https://github.com/sysrpl/Codebot.Sharp/tree/master/Codebot.Web

I'll be posting the wiki engine to that repository soon after I finish with a couple more modifications.

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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

Ralf Quint
In reply to this post by Anthony Walter-3
On 2/4/2015 3:20 AM, Anthony Walter wrote:

> Okay, I'll work on new builds ASAP which include the revision numbers
> from inside Lazarus as well as clearly labeled revision text files
> placed in the FPC and Lazarus folders. These files will contain the
> branch name and SVN revision number.
>
> I've modified the line you mentioned to read "To get the testing
> versions of Free Pascal 3.0 and Lazarus 1.4 download the setup program".
>
> To everyone else, anyone can edit the pages, so if anyone cares to
> clarify anything on any page, just click edit this page and I'll
> review an apply the changes.
On a general note, while I appreciate the overall effort, just
mentioning FPC3.0 and Lazarus 1.4, which both do not exist (just yet)
might rather backfire and give it a kind of "vaporware" look...

Also, you might reconsider to immediately trigger the download of a
random image in .exe format when switching to the "Get Lazarus" page,
that doesn't look good either, considering that this is a way how not so
nice fellows are trying to spread malware...

Just my quick 2c,

Ralf


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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

Anthony Walter-3
Ralph, regarding the first point of FPC 3.0, we already discussed it in previous replies. Check those messages to get caught up.

Regarding the automatic download, I'm not sure where you are talking about. The big DOWNLOAD NOW button with the cloud icon initiates a download, while also redirecting you to the setup page. And one hyper link with on the front page with the words "get Lazarus today" does the same thing. All other links to the setup page, which include the Universal Setup in the footer, the downloads links in the what's new page, the links in platform specific pages, just link to the setup page without initiating a download.



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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

Ralf Quint
On 2/4/2015 12:22 PM, Anthony Walter wrote:
Ralph, regarding the first point of FPC 3.0, we already discussed it in previous replies. Check those messages to get caught up.
My general objection still stands...

Regarding the automatic download, I'm not sure where you are talking about.
As soon as I click the "get Lazarus" link on the starting page, together with the download page, it immediately opens up the download dialog.
Happens in Windows 8.1/64 with Firefox 35.0.1, Opera 27.0.1689.66, Chrome 40.0.2214.94 as well as Vivaldi 1.0.94.2 and Internet Exploder 11.0.9600.17498.

I can send you the screenshots off-list...

Ralf



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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

DaWorm
Also, please make a ZIP version available for download on Windows.  Many corporate firewalls completely block downloading EXE files from non-trusted sites (and getting a site on the trusted list is non-trivial, to say the least).

Thanks,
  Jeff.

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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

Anthony Walter-3
In reply to this post by Ralf Quint
Ralph, not to be rude, but you are either not paying attention or being dense. I said: 

'And one hyper link with on the front page with the words "get Lazarus today" does the same thing.'

And it's a wiki you can edit. If you think that one link should either highlight the word today, or want it to go the setup page without downloading then change:

<a onclick="return downloadClick()">get Lazarus</a> today. 

to 

<a onclick="return downloadClick()">get Lazarus today</a>. 

or

<a href="setup">get Lazarus</a> today. 

Respectively.

With regards to FPC 3.0, either add something which hasn't already been said (Jonas and I had a nice discussion on the subject) or do nothing, which is effectively what you're doing when you object to then say nothing. The difference is one requires less typing.

DaWorm, okay, that makes sense. I'll provide an option to download setup.exe as a zip, though the final size may actually be large since the exe is a highly comrpessed self extracting and running archive. Look for it on the setup page underneath the exe installer link shortly. Ideally I'd like to get a certificate and code sign the exe and maybe even code sign a mac debugger, but both of those cost money.

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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

Ralf Quint
On 2/4/2015 2:43 PM, Anthony Walter wrote:
> Ralph, not to be rude, but you are either not paying attention or
> being dense. I said:
I am not dense, but you seem to go that direction.
For one, my name is Ralf not Ralph. Looks like you need to pay attention...
>
> 'And one hyper link with on the front page with the words "get Lazarus
> today" does the same thing.'
>
Now what the heck are you talking about? I reported to you that on five
different, current browsers, opening the download page via the "get
Lazarus" link on the home page is immediately starting a download. As
this is an .exe file, as another user already pointed out to you as
well, this is something that should be frowned upon.

Ralf



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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

Roland Schäfer
In reply to this post by Anthony Walter-3
Dear fpc-pascal,

On 02/05/2015 12:00 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
> Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2015 17:43:09 -0500
> From: Anthony Walter <[hidden email]>
> To: FPC-Pascal users discussions <[hidden email]>
> Subject: Re: [fpc-pascal] New Get Lazarus Initiative
>
> Ralph, not to be rude, but you are either not paying attention or being
> dense. I said:

I don't know what the problem of this community is, but since this list
has once again been used (EXTENSIVELY, I might add) for stuff that
belongs on fpc-other, and the tone is so often a very unpleasant one, I
am leaving it. It definitely sucked being laughed at at conferences for
writing larger projects in FPC Pascal, but this list sucks worse!

For me, the new "Get Lazarus" initiative was a highly successful
"Finally stop using FPC!" initiative. IMHO, the only initiative you need
(that doesn't exist yet) is an FPC foundation to ensure long-term
compiler development.
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Re: New Get Lazarus Initiative

Jonas Maebe-2
Hi,

The author of the mail below has in fact unsubscribed himself in the
mean time. I suggest that anyone wanting to react, does so on fpc-other.


Jonas
fpc-mailing list admin

On 05/02/15 15:27, Roland Schäfer wrote:

> Dear fpc-pascal,
>
> On 02/05/2015 12:00 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
>> Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2015 17:43:09 -0500
>> From: Anthony Walter <[hidden email]>
>> To: FPC-Pascal users discussions <[hidden email]>
>> Subject: Re: [fpc-pascal] New Get Lazarus Initiative
>>
>> Ralph, not to be rude, but you are either not paying attention or being
>> dense. I said:
>
> I don't know what the problem of this community is, but since this list
> has once again been used (EXTENSIVELY, I might add) for stuff that
> belongs on fpc-other, and the tone is so often a very unpleasant one, I
> am leaving it. It definitely sucked being laughed at at conferences for
> writing larger projects in FPC Pascal, but this list sucks worse!
>
> For me, the new "Get Lazarus" initiative was a highly successful
> "Finally stop using FPC!" initiative. IMHO, the only initiative you need
> (that doesn't exist yet) is an FPC foundation to ensure long-term
> compiler development.



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