Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
25 messages Options
12
Ben
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

Ben
Hi,

What is the programming language used in and with the Free Pascal Compiler?

* Object Pascal
* Delphi
* Free Pascal
* Pascal


I would have thought the first option [Object Pascal], but I have read
many articles/blogs on the internet which seem to refer to the Free
Pascal Compiler project's language as Free Pascal.

So what is the official word/answer on this?

If the Free Pascal Compiler project indeed does consider it having its
own Pascal dialect, named Free Pascal, then is there a list of what
syntax it has that is different to Borland's "Object Pascal", or
Embarcadero's "Delphi" language?


--

            Ben.

_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

Marco van de Voort
In our previous episode, Ben said:
> What is the programming language used in and with the Free Pascal Compiler?
>
> * Object Pascal
> * Delphi
> * Free Pascal
> * Pascal

Pretty much all apply.  Free Pascal has a mode concept with 5/6 modes.

The first is a Turbo Pascal compatible mode, but the object extensions of
Turbo Pascal were also called "object pascal" in the day.

The second is a fpc (Free Pascal mode), which is a Turbo Pascal like mode
with some extensions and some limiting backwards compatibility features of
Turbo mode removed.

The third is a Delphi compatible mode, which, by Borland itself, was called
"Object Pascal" too.

The fourth is the "Object Free Pascal" mode, which is more like a "strict"
Delphi mode.

The fifth is a Mac Pascal mode whose Pascal was also called "Object Pascal"
in the day. This mode also has a submode called "objectIVE Pascal".

The sixth is an ISO Pascal mode, and together with Mac Pascal mode it comes
closest to the original Pascal (the Borland dialects, Turbo and Delphi are
based on a subset of the original Pascal). This mode is only available in
development versions.

The reason for so many "Object Pascal" names is that there were many
attempts to add Objects to Pascal, but they all take the name of an early
proposal to do so.

The "Objective" mode is not related to that, but to Objective C, the
language where parts of the OS X system interfaces are specified in.

> If the Free Pascal Compiler project indeed does consider it having its
> own Pascal dialect, named Free Pascal, then is there a list of what
> syntax it has that is different to Borland's "Object Pascal", or
> Embarcadero's "Delphi" language?

The FPC modes are mostly variants of the Borland modes. Delphi is a bit of a
problematic term because there is no formal standard, and the various
Delphi versions don't always agree on things.

In general, the compatibility with older versions (up to D7) is very high,
only some more exotic things are not implemented. Libraries will probably
pose a bigger problem than language.
_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

Jonas Maebe-2

On 08 Feb 2011, at 09:58, Marco van de Voort wrote:

> The fifth is a Mac Pascal mode whose Pascal was also called "Object  
> Pascal"
> in the day. This mode also has a submode called "objectIVE Pascal".

Objective-Pascal is unrelated to the Mac Pascal mode:
a) syntactically they are not related
b) Objective-Pascal is a modeswitch (rather than a syntax mode) and  
can be used in combination with every syntax mode (from TP to to  
ObjFPC to ISO)


Jonas

_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

Jonas Maebe-2
In reply to this post by Ben

On 08 Feb 2011, at 09:34, Ben wrote:

> If the Free Pascal Compiler project indeed does consider it having its
> own Pascal dialect, named Free Pascal, then is there a list of what
> syntax it has that is different to Borland's "Object Pascal", or
> Embarcadero's "Delphi" language?

I don't think there's an exhaustive list, but the main differences are  
mentioned at http://www.freepascal.org/docs-html/prog/progse75.html 
and http://www.freepascal.org/port.var


Jonas
_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

Cees Binkhorst
In reply to this post by Ben
It is even mentioned here (together with 43,5 other Pascal dialects :)

http://99-bottles-of-beer.net/

On 02/08/2011 09:34 AM, Ben wrote:

> Hi,
>
> What is the programming language used in and with the Free Pascal Compiler?
>
> * Object Pascal
> * Delphi
> * Free Pascal
> * Pascal
>
>
> I would have thought the first option [Object Pascal], but I have read
> many articles/blogs on the internet which seem to refer to the Free
> Pascal Compiler project's language as Free Pascal.
>
> So what is the official word/answer on this?
>
> If the Free Pascal Compiler project indeed does consider it having its
> own Pascal dialect, named Free Pascal, then is there a list of what
> syntax it has that is different to Borland's "Object Pascal", or
> Embarcadero's "Delphi" language?
>
>
_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

Mark Morgan Lloyd-5
In reply to this post by Marco van de Voort
Marco van de Voort wrote:
> In our previous episode, Ben said:
>> What is the programming language used in and with the Free Pascal Compiler?
>>
>> * Object Pascal
>> * Delphi
>> * Free Pascal
>> * Pascal
>
> Pretty much all apply.  Free Pascal has a mode concept with 5/6 modes.

I think that we need to distinguish between the name of the language
(either Pascal or Object Pascal) and the implementation (Free Pascal).
It's entirely reasonable that there be variations in the underlying
language depending on implementation.

I'd suggest that an issue to be considered is what facilities are
available in the language by default, i.e. with no command line options,
embedded directives or "uses" statements.

--
Mark Morgan Lloyd
markMLl .AT. telemetry.co .DOT. uk

[Opinions above are the author's, not those of his employers or colleagues]
_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

leledumbo
Administrator
Moreover, we need to distinguish between the base (i.e. standard) language and the implemented language (and its extensions). Almost all programming languages with more than one implementations do. For instance, standard C cannot have nested functions, but C implemented by GCC can. Standard C cannot have ... to mark range in case part of a switch statement, but C implemented by GCC can.
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

Ingemar Ragnemalm
In reply to this post by Ben

Mark Morgan Lloyd <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Marco van de Voort wrote:
>  
>> In our previous episode, Ben said:
>>    
>>> What is the programming language used in and with the Free Pascal Compiler?
>>>
>>> * Object Pascal
>>> * Delphi
>>> * Free Pascal
>>> * Pascal
>>>      
>> Pretty much all apply.  Free Pascal has a mode concept with 5/6 modes.
>>    
>
> I think that we need to distinguish between the name of the language
> (either Pascal or Object Pascal) and the implementation (Free Pascal).
> It's entirely reasonable that there be variations in the underlying
> language depending on implementation.
>
> I'd suggest that an issue to be considered is what facilities are
> available in the language by default, i.e. with no command line options,
> embedded directives or "uses" statements.
>  

It is all of them.

Object Pascal is a superset of Pascal. Delphi is a variant of Object
Pascal (an implementation of
OP plus a RAD). Free Pascal is an implementation and extension of all
the others.

I consider myself an FPC programmer rather than a Pascal programmer
simply because it is important
to stress that I am not clinging to the 70's original Pascal but a
modern language. Strangely enough,
you have to make that clear, while few C programmers are expected to use
the K&R C of the same time
even though they don't present themselves as "C99 programmers" or "ANSI
C programmers".


/Ingemar

_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

vfclists .
In reply to this post by Ben


On 8 February 2011 08:34, Ben <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hi,

What is the programming language used in and with the Free Pascal Compiler?

* Object Pascal
* Delphi
* Free Pascal
* Pascal


I would have thought the first option [Object Pascal], but I have read
many articles/blogs on the internet which seem to refer to the Free
Pascal Compiler project's language as Free Pascal.

So what is the official word/answer on this?

If the Free Pascal Compiler project indeed does consider it having its
own Pascal dialect, named Free Pascal, then is there a list of what
syntax it has that is different to Borland's "Object Pascal", or
Embarcadero's "Delphi" language?





How about Apollo?


 
--

           Ben.

_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal



--
Frank Church

=======================
http://devblog.brahmancreations.com

_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Ben
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

Ben
Op 2011-02-16 11:48, Frank Church het geskryf:
>
> How about Apollo?

Some might suggest "Titanic" too. :-)


With my original post I wasn't actually asking for new suggestions, but
simply if FPC considers the language it uses as a "new" language named
for example "Free Pascal", or does it still consider it as standard
"Object Pascal".

But with everybody's replies, I guess it is a difficult question to
answer, because FPC has many hats (various compiler modes), which
affects the language syntax. Even so, I would like to think compiler
mode ObjFPC is FPC's native/default language - the others are just nice
gestures for compatibility sake.


--

            Ben.

_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

Matt Emson-2
In reply to this post by vfclists .
On 16/02/2011 09:48, Frank Church wrote:
>
> How about Apollo?

This was the code name for Adobe Air - I expect it would be hard to get
traction if Adobe still hold some kind of rights over it.


_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

greim
In reply to this post by Ben
I suggest to ask first

Professor Niklaus Wirth

Regards

Markus Greim
_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

Rich Saunders
On 2/16/11 5:40 AM, greim wrote:
> I suggest to ask first Professor Niklaus Wirth
I think he has moved on long ago.


_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

Sven Barth-2
Am 16.02.2011 17:20, schrieb Rich Saunders:
> On 2/16/11 5:40 AM, greim wrote:
>> I suggest to ask first Professor Niklaus Wirth
> I think he has moved on long ago.

Don't let him know that, as he's still happily alive:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niklaus_Wirth

Regards,
Sven
_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

Rich Saunders
On 2/16/11 11:27 AM, Sven Barth wrote:
> ...he's still happily alive: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niklaus_Wirth
Of course he is. I only meant he has not paid much attention to the
Pascal language for decades. ;)

_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

Sven Barth-2
Am 16.02.2011 17:36, schrieb Rich Saunders:
> On 2/16/11 11:27 AM, Sven Barth wrote:
>> ...he's still happily alive: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niklaus_Wirth
> Of course he is. I only meant he has not paid much attention to the
> Pascal language for decades. ;)

In that case I've misunderstood you ^^

Regards,
Sven
_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

leledumbo
Administrator
In reply to this post by Rich Saunders
Yeah, he let Pascal in the last state he worked on. But don't you know he's also an actor behind (Apple's) Object Pascal?
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

vfclists .


On 16 February 2011 16:51, leledumbo <[hidden email]> wrote:

Yeah, he let Pascal in the last state he worked on. But don't you know he's
also an actor behind (Apple's) Object Pascal?
--
View this message in context: http://free-pascal-general.1045716.n5.nabble.com/Name-of-the-programming-language-used-in-with-FPC-tp3375543p3387995.html
Sent from the Free Pascal - General mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
_______________________________________________


How about Dijkstra?

This will focus minds our wonderfully and will lead us to ensure that our programs are derived correctly from precise unambiguous semantically sound specifications.
.
I mean, we can't call our language Dijkstra and write buggy programs, can we?

We should consider it a challenge.

Let the voting begin!!


--
Frank Church

=======================
http://devblog.brahmancreations.com

_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

Doug Chamberlin-2
On 2/17/11 12:04 PM, Frank Church wrote:
> How about Dijkstra?
Where can I send a letter to the editor saying "Naming the language
Dijkstra is considered harmful." ;)

_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Name of the programming language used in/with FPC

Cees Binkhorst
Philippe Kahn did more for Pascal then Dijkstra.

He expanded it and made it soo cheaply available that it was an instant
winner.

Regards / Cees

On 02/17/2011 07:32 PM, Doug Chamberlin wrote:
> On 2/17/11 12:04 PM, Frank Church wrote:
>> How about Dijkstra?
> Where can I send a letter to the editor saying "Naming the language
> Dijkstra is considered harmful." ;)
>
> _______________________________________________
> fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
> http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
>
_______________________________________________
fpc-pascal maillist  -  [hidden email]
http://lists.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/fpc-pascal
12